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Can you tell I like bullpups?

 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:20 am 
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Have you gone for 100+ rps? I've heard it was possible, and I'd like to see someone try it!


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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:05 am 
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The idea has crossed my mind. I'll see about hitting it sometime. As it is, I could probably do it with an 18.5v lipo. But a faster motor would certainly help. I have an older SHS Torque I could put in that should do the trick. But I'd probably kill the motor.

The thing about 100rps is that it doesn't feed. Realistically, you can't get anything to feed past 90rps. lol, my basic plan was to use the A2 that used to be in the 417, stick it in the fn2k and just clock it at 100 cyclic rps, then downgrade to the motor I have in it now. However, the 417 has been giving me such difficulties, that the project was scraped. I may still attempt it later on, but for now, it runs incredibly well, that I don't have the heart to mess with it.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 11:06 am 
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A mag can feed at 90 rounds a second!? I thought the lonex flash mag could only feed 70-80 rps. What mags are you using for the fn2000?


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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 11:29 am 
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Lonex flash mags, but even those, as you said, cap out around 80rps using .2g bbs. Very few midcaps will feed at 90, highest I've heard of is 88, and it was a modified midcap at that. And at that point, your midcap is gone in a second. It's been theorized that a double feeding drum mag could feed at rates exceeding 90rps, but no one has successfully made one to feed that fast, and it is a project that is useless to me. If someone wants a gun to fire in excess of 100rps, you should talk to fallout about how to make a flame thrower.

Getting an AEG to a cyclic 100rps is only for bragging rights, and serves no real purpose but to kill motors, pistons, gears, and springs. Could be fun, but it could also be a huge money sink just for something that isn't fieldable.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 11:36 am 
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Team Redemption's tank has a main gun that fires in excess of 100rps, but it is an entiredly different system and loading mechanism. It runs dry after a few minutes of excessive use.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 11:47 am 
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There are two systems that can feed faster than 100rps. The strafers, vortex guns, flamethrowers, you know, the awful device at the front of Fallout's tank, and certain miniguns, which is what I think Redemption uses.

Vortex guns/flamethrowers use air to push the bbs into the barrel and then through the barrel.

Miniguns actually have 6 separate loading mechanisms, one for each barrel. While it's shooting/rotating at 120rps, it's really only needing to feed at 20rps. This makes things much, much simpler, and easier, to feed.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 11:48 am 
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Only thing is, at SOCO last year, we ran out of ammo in that tank, thus causing an overun of GA players -_- When it did fire it was racking up kills.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 12:44 pm 
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The other option to get to this high rate of fire is a polar star fusion engion. No need for worries of killing a motor, piston or so on.


I agree with your overall comment that this high of a rate of fire has no practical purpose on the field. Blowing through a mag in a second or less is pointless.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 12:50 pm 
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I'm sure Dom would agree, but anything past 50 is pointless. IMO, 40 is more or less the breaking point. The only reason I started out on this high rof build was because I wanted a gun that could do safe/semi/burst, and I wanted the burst to finish before I finished pulling the trigger. I never intended to use the gun in full auto. The first game I used it at, burst was more than enough to hit people, and I still used semi for most of the day.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 5:03 pm 
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^40 rps

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:00 am 
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Yep, the "awful device" at the front of my tank is indeed a vortex block gun, and fires just over 105 rounds per second (varies a bit based on how full the reservoir is). It can do this only because it has no 'rest cycle' (i.e. there is no bolt or any other moving parts, hence the bolt is never closed), and more than 1 BB is actually in the barrel at any given time. The complete lack of moving parts contributes greatly to reliability.

That said, it has its own inherent problems, namely that in operation pressurized gas is being rapidly released to atmosphere, creating a huge temperature drop at the constrictions/orifices (see also Brayton cycle throttling valve, i.e. a key component in air conditioning/heat pump systems, an adiabatic pressure drop through a nozzle) and with it, ice (from moisture in the air) and dry ice (it gets cold enough to cause the CO2 gas flowing past to solidify) formation, which eventually clogs the mechanism, jamming the weapon. So even with it, you may notice that we stick to short bursts (just like "Hitler's Buzzsaw", the MG-42, which was my inspiration) and eventually have to withdraw as the gun "overheats" (actually overcools).
I made no effort to correct this design flaw, as I thought it added a cool (lol) and semi-realistic touch, as rapid and sustained fire of a real rapid fire weapon (including real HMG's) will eventually overheat and jam them, another reason for the persistence of multi-barrelled weapons like the minigun (which uses multiple barrels to better distribute and remove the heat created) more than 150 years after Mr. Gatling's original design.

It is also an ammo and gas hog, making it expensive to operate (~30,000 rounds per event is typical).

The minigun, since it actually has a great deal of moving parts, have durability/reliability issues, at least according to the field owner I know who has one, and cannot be fired for more than 5 seconds at a time (per the manufacturer's warning).


Last edited by fallout11 on Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:03 am 
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fallout11 wrote:
Yep, the "awful device" at the front of my tank is indeed a vortex block gun, and fires just over 105 rounds per second (varies a bit based on how full the reservoir is). It can do this only because it has no 'rest cycle' (i.e. there is no bolt or any other moving parts, hence the bolt is never closed), and more than 1 BB is actually in the barrel at any given time.

That said, it has its own inherent problems, namely that in operation pressurized gas is being rapidly released to atmosphere, creating a huge temperature drop at the constrictions/orifices (see also Brayton cycle throttling valve, i.e. a key component in air conditioning/heat pump systems, an adiabatic pressure drop through a nozzle) and with it, ice (from moisture in the air) and dry ice (it gets cold enough to cause the CO2 gas flowing past to solidify) formation, which eventually clogs the mechanism, jamming the weapon. So even with it, you may notice that we stick to short, controlled bursts (just like "Hitler's Buzzsaw", the MG-42, which was my inspiration) and eventually have to withdraw as the gun "overheats" (actually overcools).
I made no effort to correct this design flaw, as I thought it added a cool (lol) and semi-realistic touch, as rapid and sustained fire of a real rapid fire weapon (including real HMG's) will eventually overheat and jam them, another reason for the persistence of multi-barrelled weapons like the minigun (which uses multiple barrels to better distribute and remove the heat created) more than 150 years after Mr. Gatling's original design.

It is also an ammo and gas hog, making it expensive to operate (~30,000 rounds per event is typical).

So there is a weakness....

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:57 pm 
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398+/-2fps, 40rps, 300ft Max/250ft effective range.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:46 pm 
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The only way to describe it.


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 Post subject: Re: Can you tell I like bullpups?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:04 pm 
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So you're the one that got the Reece rifle on ASF! I wanted that!


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