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The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming

 Post subject: The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:23 am 
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F.N.G.
F.N.G.

Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2011 1:05 am
Posts: 41
Ok so here is my thinking, and a project I have been working on. SlickRidley a while back invited me to join up with him, but the distance traveled etc would have made it semi pointless. I also had friends/players in my region that just werent as enthusastic, until we started doing firearms training in conjunction with airsoft milsim stuff. I am no where a expert, but have gotten some decently advanced training through the years, and some firearms training. That said I will consider myself a trainer in training, and by no means have the answers.

What I have seen and Issues with what I have seen.

Reading Material

1. FM 7-8 has been abused to the floor, and while having good portions of knowledge and useful info, I feel much of it really can't be used at most fields/events and extracting portions would be a smart idea. I have done this, and others have done this for real training purposes. I have been compileing some of this.

2. Ranger Handbook again basically the FM 7-8 with some extras. I think the resources from both are great, but much of it is vastly useless for the most part. Also distances etc need to be changed for Airsoft as well.

3. Airsoft Magazines - Probably one of the best rehash areas for good training info, and built for the airsofter, but can be spotty and hard to get. Also the articles are copywrited so you will still have to redo the info.

Video Material

1. Youtube - Hit or miss but some of it is really good be it limited. The big issue is some of these videos have copywrited music so they get deleted from time to time.

2. Firearms videos - Better but can be trend, weapon specific, and most (pretty much all I have seen) are geared to small unit training.

So this is a bit of the open resource materail either purchased or free. My goal is to get the Milsim crowd to work on a Field Manual concept, and training program to get new people, and new groups trained up so they know how to operate in reliable and informed manner. Also so we can get people to have fun doing the training and enjoying milsim events this way.

So my questions to the community in general.

Would any of you be behind this type of project?

Would this project even be viable?

If yes could any of you contribute or possibly attempt the training and bring feed back beyond, yeah its good?

What else am I missing here?


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 Post subject: Re: The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 11:55 pm 
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Mark, seeing as how no one wishes to entertain the idea, I will go ahead and volunteer to war game your material that you decide to compile together. I do believe if the material was directly connected and viable in airsoft, much more people would be interested, as sifting through infantry manuals can be good, but trying to determine what is and isn't viable is usually a pain in the ass, and to buy a $20 book from amazon that is 200 pages long only to use maybe 40-50 blows. With that being said, I will give you feed back and get opinions from the people we play with and see what they think. Good idea, just know its going to take alot of work for the general player base to even glance at it.


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 Post subject: Re: The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 1:14 am 
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AJAXian
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Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2009 8:05 pm
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This has been done in other partsof the country. I actually have taken basic and advanced squad tactics, advanced tech & tactical proceedured and MOUT training from a US Army Master Trainer who after seeing all the cash people spent on gear and guns but had no clue how to use them took the feild manuals you mentioned, culled them down and rewrote them for airsoft applications. He puts on Operation Pine Plains and was a founderof MSATO.org. I do have one of the manuals we used for those classes that I need to scan for AJAX use.

In a similar line of thougt, AJAX has plans of running training days later this year when temps are too hot to play nonstop. We'll do some "classroom" training then go out to practice what we jus learned/taught.

My hopes would be that people take the time to learn proper techniques then employ them on the field. The quality of play will only increase through this and we'll see more games that fit into an actual "MilSim" definition in SC

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fine print: sometimes I'm serious and post middle of the ground statements based on logic, other times I will post something absurd just to point out the sheer lunacy of someone's opinion. Other times I may post something directed specifically at another forum member just to be a smartass. Don't take it personally, it's all in good fun.


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 Post subject: Re: The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 4:38 pm 
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this sounds like a good idea,but there is a few problems with how this would work out. First I would like to say that if we are talking about making it a legit Milsim then the first problem with this is finding "Realcap" Magazines.
Second is finding vest's that look almost spot on that won't break the bank. Also the whole team thing I think that if we do it by signing up online (as in they send the host a P.M.) and then pretty much randomly pick who is on what team (Like op. Irene) with a twist on it.
Sorry for my rant not trying to bust your balls but lastly there needs to be experienced people in command (ex. Army,Marines,Airforce,Navy,or any JROTC or ROTC cadets) I myself am in NJROTC and have been in a leadership position and if you don't know what your doing it turns into a cluster fuck
i am done with my rant hope you find somethin useful in this.


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 Post subject: Re: The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:08 pm 
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Any midcap can be a "realcap"... just load X number of BBs to match the real firearm. This is a non-issue.

Vests: Uuuh.... a non-issue aswell. Virtually every rig has been used in some way by the real military. Just because something is issued doesn't mean it's the only thing in use.

Command: There's a whole lot more to running a team than ROTC training. One of the best field commanders I've seen in SC (Tanker) has zero military experience to my knowledge. Most of the ROTC cadets I've had any field time with have been convinced that they were much more skilled than they really were. I've been fairly impressed with the Extorrus guys from the Citadel, but the vast majority of the ROTC kids seem to be no more proficient at actually playing airsoft than the new kid with his Walmart shotgun.

As far as real military goes, many of the real soldiers I've played with had combat experience, but combat experience does not equal a good strategy-minded brain.

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 Post subject: Re: The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:26 pm 
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AJAXian
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I agree on the Command point made by Steevo. Just because it is Mil-Sim does not mean that "Military Personnel" have to be in the command / leadership position. If it were set up like that no one would want to play and instead would join the military. Military experience is not a one up in airsoft. Yes, it comes in handy, but everyone is equal in this HOBBY. No one can get leadership experience if we limit it to military personnel only.

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 Post subject: Re: The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 6:31 pm 
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Sorry guys this a shared account and one of my idiot try hard rotc friends wrote that and i agree being in command involves the brain not combat or any experience of being in charge i too am in NJROTC with him and have been to leadership camp at the citadel. That was a good experience but i do not think me or him are ready for complete leadership positions and the vest i was talking to him and he was trying to say that any vest is fine to a point but his dad was a army ranger and his dad said that some load outs for milsims are over packed with mags I'm ganna have to agree with him because when you have 20 midcaps thats a little bit overboard you really only need at most 10 midcaps also if this were to happen would there be 1 sniper-spotter team i went to a event up in Indiana and they only allowed one sniper per team? would we do that or would it kill it like i think it will


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 Post subject: Re: The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:33 pm 
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AJAXian
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Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2009 4:40 pm
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We are talking airsoft... Being a leader means making logical decisions and sticking with them, having strategic knowledge, and know what your forces are capable of... Anyone can do it, but everyone would rather be on the field shooting at each other instead of sitting at HQ answering a radio about engagements and directing forces to objectives.

ANY VEST IS OKAY... If it carries magazines and matches your uniform then who cares. As for magazines... That is up to the person running the event to put a limit on the number of magazines allowed on field. If there is no limit then it is at the users discretion.

As for snipers, unless they have a well built rifle that can reach out and touch, they are useless.

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 Post subject: Re: The A,B,Cs of milsim brainstorming
PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:29 pm 
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ight thanks for the good feed back and i was not trying to troll or go on a rant


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